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  • Topic: Lots of gun talk lately on social media

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    • August 28, 2015 9:18 AM PDT
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      Lots of gun talk lately on social media

      Not to bring additional off topic drama here, but oh boy... after what went down in Virginia the other day. I've been bummed. The state of mental health and pro gun nut is at epidemic levels.

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    • August 31, 2015 9:35 AM PDT
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      For a while I wondered if we had a mental health problem. Mentally ill people are getting firearms and killing people. But that's not it; There is no indication that the United States has more mentally ill people than any other country. 

      The problem is access to firearms. With easy access, the mentally ill - those are hide in society and pretend to be normal - have easy access to firearms. 

      Case in point is my friend John. He owns an AR15. He has been medically disabled for the past twenty years. He has "water on the brain", has had a dozen operations on his brain, and operates on the level of a sixteen year old. He was married twice, and has a two kids with his first wife in Germany while he was stationed there with the US Army. His wife left him shortly after he was diagnosed with his illness, and he has had little contact with his kids. His second wife left him. He hasn't worked in over twenty years, and is disalbed from both the US Army and US Post Office - he has money, but is utterly bored because he has too much free time. He is depressed and on a lot of medication. But yet there is nothing stopping him from having an AR15. 

      The man who shot that reporter... All of the signs were there, but there is nothing anyone can do. What can you do? Call the police and say "this man shouldn't have firearms" and if you are lucky they police might interview the person, but they will most likely walk away saying "there is nothing we can do". 

      The young man who shot all of those kids a while back.... No one found it odd that a loner who had no interest in joining the military or law enforcement was intersted in firearms in a huge way. Instead, his mother used firearms as a tool to be "closer" to her son. She paid for that with her own life. 

      We need stricter controls on firearms. And for the love of god, there is no reason for anyone to own an AR15. Ever. 

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    • August 31, 2015 11:49 AM PDT
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      What can you do? 

      Ban guns. Simple.  Not 100 per cent effective, but works pretty well.

    • August 31, 2015 12:14 PM PDT
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      I've been for banning guns ever since I was a teen.

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    • August 31, 2015 1:40 PM PDT
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      The cat is out of the bag, and that's what makes it so difficult. Any attempt to restrict access is positioned as a conspiracy by The Government to disarm the public. It's going to take a huge movement from the public to make any real change on this, I think. Some mega protests and marches. Not just Black Lives Matter, but All lives matter, Kids matter, mental health matters, poverty matters. Otherwise no single politician is going to be willing to take the chance. :(

    • August 31, 2015 2:28 PM PDT
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      I would have to say I agree with that Elli. Something seriously revolutional.

       

      And as well things have to get worse before they'll get better... I find that the discussions I have with people in the biz whether they are for or against tend to be MUCH more productive and civil vs. conversations that I have with others in the general public.

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    • August 31, 2015 9:36 PM PDT
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      hardball said:

      What can you do? 

      Ban guns. Simple.  Not 100 per cent effective, but works pretty well.

      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

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    • September 1, 2015 6:56 AM PDT
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      The first thing you will need is a new ruling on amedment #2 to the constitution before any gun ban could be put in place.

      Check the heller case 2008 and the McDonald case in 2010.

       

    • September 1, 2015 7:38 AM PDT
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      iFriendsTim said:

      The first thing you will need is a new ruling on amedment #2 to the constitution before any gun ban could be put in place.

      Check the heller case 2008 and the McDonald case in 2010.

       

      An ammendment is a change.  So is it possible to ammend an ammendment?

    • September 1, 2015 8:11 AM PDT
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      hardball said:
      iFriendsTim said:

      The first thing you will need is a new ruling on amedment #2 to the constitution before any gun ban could be put in place.

      Check the heller case 2008 and the McDonald case in 2010.

       

      An ammendment is a change.  So is it possible to ammend an ammendment?

      Actually yes, if the Supreme court reinterprets the way they see a law or an admendment to the constituion.

       

      You can also pass an admendment, (cumbersome process requiring ratification by 38 of 50 states) that overturns a previous admendment.

      See the 18th Admendment and the 21st admendment for an example.

    • September 1, 2015 8:19 AM PDT
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      rochard said:
      hardball said:

      What can you do? 

      Ban guns. Simple.  Not 100 per cent effective, but works pretty well.

      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      Yes it worked in Australia. And I'm so sick of the "only the criminals will have firearms" bullshit. How many mental health nut jobs or people who aren't criminals now have guns obtained legally? A lot. And even some criminals do have guns, how often does it happen that a civilian who is both armed and trained AND with the sense of mind to thwart an attack with their gun? rarely.

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    • September 1, 2015 8:55 AM PDT
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      US loves their guns.. no way in hell are they taking that away. 

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    • September 1, 2015 10:16 AM PDT
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      YNOTJay said:

      Yes it worked in Australia. And I'm so sick of the "only the criminals will have firearms" bullshit. How many mental health nut jobs or people who aren't criminals now have guns obtained legally? A lot. And even some criminals do have guns, how often does it happen that a civilian who is both armed and trained AND with the sense of mind to thwart an attack with their gun? rarely.

      I think an important difference is the gun ownership in Australia was only at 7%. http://www.factcheck.org/2009/05/gun-control-in-australia/ It decreased to 5% 13 years after the law change. The US has no firm stats on gun ownership, as many gun owners own multiple firearms and registration of many guns isn't mandatory. http://www.factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/ Polls like the following estimate closer to 30-60% ownership rates. 

      "The Small Arms Survey, a project of the Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies in Geneva, estimated in 2007 that there were 270 million civilian-owned firearms in the U.S. In 2001, there were an estimated 230 million. "

      "Background-check numbers show a similar trend. They went from 11 million background checks in 2007 to 16.8 million in 2012, with December’s numbers not yet part of that tally,according to the FBI. Background checks are not an indication of sales, however, as they’re not always required, for instance for personal sales at gun shows in some states, and one purchaser can buy more than one firearm."

      11 million people running background checks in one year? Compare that to only 7.6million people in the US buying passenger cars that year. 

      In this case Australia is a very poor comparison. Wikipedia says " In 2005 almost 3% of households in Canada possessed handguns, compared to 18% of U.S. households that possessed handguns.[4] In 2005 almost 16% of households in Canada possessed firearms of some kind.[4]Canada has required permits for handguns since 1892, so that's not a fair comparison, either. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Canada)

      Disarming a nation is tricky businsess and is probably fairly impossible. I think a best case scenario would see a national registry and tighter purchasing restrictions.

       

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    • September 1, 2015 10:44 AM PDT
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      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

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    • September 1, 2015 10:47 AM PDT
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      massdad said:
      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

      I certainly hope that is not the case.

    • September 1, 2015 11:15 AM PDT
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      hardball said:
      massdad said:
      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

      I certainly hope that is not the case.

       

      I believe it is a lot of the time. If an office discharges his firearm at a citizen that did not pose an immediate danger to the officer there will be hearings and possible charges filed. This includes a suspect with a gun to the head of a hostage. They often times delay shooting until a superior order is given. 

       

      A cop who claims to have killed a gunman because it was obvious that citizens would have been in fear of their own lives and he was only protecting them from possible harm.. is a cop who is in serious trouble. He or she would have to lie and say the perp turned the gun on me.

       

       

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    • September 1, 2015 11:19 AM PDT
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      hardball said:
      massdad said:
      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

      Well let me DASH you hopes then.

      His gun is for his protection, it is very rare that an officer swings into a bank like Bruce Willis and stumbles on a situation where he is protecting other unarmed people.

      The gun is on his side for HIS protection, just think about it.

      I certainly hope that is not the case.

       

    • September 1, 2015 11:55 AM PDT
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      but at the end of the day less guns, less murder.  More guns, more murder.

    • September 1, 2015 12:56 PM PDT
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      hardball said:

      but at the end of the day less guns, less murder.  More guns, more murder.

       

       

      Less guns, less gun murders. There is not indication that people will stop murdering others if there where no guns. None at all. An estranger youth with mental disorders is just as capable of blowing up a church with a gas can bomb. If a person is set on murder, they will murder, guns or not.

       

      But no guns means that the citizen is at the disadvantage in all cases where a nurderer has their sights set on them. At least with a gun you have a fighting chance. .. which is why cops carry them.

       

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    • September 1, 2015 1:11 PM PDT
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      YNOTJay said:

      Not to bring additional off topic drama here, but oh boy... after what went down in Virginia the other day. I've been bummed. The state of mental health and pro gun nut is at epidemic levels.

       

       

      Wanna know what I have been reading on social media? 

      White kid kills church full of black christians and liberal media calls it racism.

      Illegal alien kills white woman and it's ignored by liberal media.

      Black man kills white reporters and liberal media crys gun control.

      Maybe it's time we filter our social media.

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    • September 1, 2015 1:29 PM PDT
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      massdad said:
      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

      Yes, but they need a gun because the bad guys have guns. If the US was to offer up a buy out program nationwide and then outlaw firearms, eventually firearms will be rare - and police officers will no longer need to carry them on a regular basis. 

       

       

    • September 1, 2015 6:17 PM PDT
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      newswire said:
      massdad said:
      rochard said:
      But they say "you can't do that". They'll say "only the criminals will have firearms". No, law enforcement will also have firearms. Eventually all of the firearms will be found and destroyed. They did a buy back in Southern California once - I just happened to get caught up in it while visiting the the Space Shutle - and it was insane. 

      They did it in Austrailia and it seemed to work very well and very quickly. 

       

      A Police officer has a gun to protect his life, not to protect yours. 

      Yes, but they need a gun because the bad guys have guns. If the US was to offer up a buy out program nationwide and then outlaw firearms, eventually firearms will be rare - and police officers will no longer need to carry them on a regular basis. 

       

       

       

       

       

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    • September 1, 2015 6:58 PM PDT
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      64% of all gun deaths are suicides.

      34% of all gun deaths are murders.

      2% of all gun deaths are accidents.

      Outlawing guns in the US would drop only two percent of the deaths. Murders will still happen as will suicides. Your statistically not effecting much with a total gun ban.

       

      Automobiles however are 98% deaths due to accidents.

      1% murder and 1% suicide.

      Outlawing automobiles would end almost all the deaths atributed to them. Murders will still happen as will suicides. Statistically you effect olmost everything with a total automobile ban.

       

      Factual food for thought.

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    • September 1, 2015 7:01 PM PDT
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